B C Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 How new of a BMW do you feel comfortable about owning/working on/driving hard? Im sure for some of the resident BMW technicians any newer BMW is easy to diagnose, work on, and keep going well past the warranty period. Unfortunately I am not a technician. I live in a world of rage drifting and single cam simplicity. I get scared thinking about what it would take to keep a newer BMW going. I am sure that with an above average level of expendable income it wouldn't be a problem and I could pay a shop $10k a year to keep things in check. When I hear about some of the parts costs and see the lack of wrench space on newer BMWs, my VANOS solenoid goes into limp mode. At my current comfort level, I don't think I would like to try to afford or try to maintain anything newer than an E36 M3. The S52 is still relatively simple and isn't horribly cramped to work on and the majority of parts can be had from the M50/M52 cars which are cheap and abundant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoungCR Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 E39 or E46 will probably be the latest cars I buy for a long time. E90's are temping though but I'd rather have more older cars. andyhundley 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 S5x for me. I am but a simple man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HipMF Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 wut? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasnt m3 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 E46 is still very simple and ultra reliable. I personally put 100k miles(on top of the 60k when I bought it) on the touring I drove for 7 years. Never had to pay anyone to work on it other than an alignment. Preventative maintenance goes a long way. It seems that most people don't understand that these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patsbimmer1 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 Whatever the Y/M/M, bring it on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
straight6pwr Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 i'd say e34/e36/e32 for me, but i have never worked on anything newer. the 'engineering' in those models gives me a 'wtf' every now and then. i really didnt even want to get an e34 over an e30. they are still built fairly simple, but they started to throw lots of dumb electronics/systems that complicated things, without providing much actually improvement. self leveling - pointless. vanos - pointless. ACS in place of LSD - useless and complitcated. HVAC system with multiple computers, too many dials, etc - dumb. EWS - dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HipMF Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 17 minutes ago, straight6pwr said: ...HVAC system with multiple computers, too many dials, etc - dumb... agreed. Something is amiss with the e34. It gets plenty warm, eventually, but it's not so good at defrosting the windshield... I'd like to fix it, but I'm just to damned lazy to do the research to figure out how the whole system works, and then spend even more time trying to diagnose what's wrong with it... give me some cable-actuated flappy valves and fan speed control and i'll be comfotable, and can I fix it without a 4-page wiring diagram. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REKIII Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 I'd go to an e90. Really hate the e60, but I would work on one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patsbimmer1 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 I don't understand the fear of working on new cars. A car is a car is a car. The technology advances but as long as you understand the basic principles and have basic diagnostic skills you can build on those as the tech advances. That might be oversimplifying but there really doesn't need to be any fear of new tech. And for what it's worth, a lot of this tech is an advancement and has a purpose and not just an over complication of a simple system. You mention VANOS, that was and continues to be and advancement to deliver increase power in a wider power band while delivering higher MPG ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REKIII Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 For me, it's not a fear, it's the pain of it, and the special tools one needs to acquire. Also, if I really dislike the car, then I'm going to be much less willing to work on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
straight6pwr Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 34 minutes ago, patsbimmer1 said: I don't understand the fear of working on new cars. A car is a car is a car. The technology advances but as long as you understand the basic principles and have basic diagnostic skills you can build on those as the tech advances. That might be oversimplifying but there really doesn't need to be any fear of new tech. And for what it's worth, a lot of this tech is an advancement and has a purpose and not just an over complication of a simple system. You mention VANOS, that was and continues to be and advancement to deliver increase power in a wider power band while delivering higher MPG ratings. its not fear of working on, or even the inability to fix something. its the frustration that something complex has broken, and if it had been simple in the first place, it wouldn't have, or would be easier to fix. when my e34's hvac stops working, and i have to dismantle half my dashboard to get at some control computer, its not fun, not rewarding and just a waste of my time. if the hvac system stopped in an e30, i would check a fuse or a relay and be done with it. i'm not any more comfortable in my e34 as far as temperature control than the e30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suspenceful Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 I was nervous buying my 2008 E82 initially. Just like any car, once you become more familiar with it, it becomes easier to work on. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another N54 or N55 powered car. BMW is still using these motors on brand new models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted February 10, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 DrLeadfoot's E46 not starting is a good example. Without an extremely detailed service manual, I wouldn't suspect the hood being popped to be a possible cause for a no-start condition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassboy3313 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 Nothing newer than an e30 simply because I'm not a fan of how bmw's newer than that look. Nothing to do with mechanicals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
straight6pwr Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Bassboy3313 said: Nothing newer than an e30 simply because I'm not a fan of how bmw's newer than that look. Nothing to do with mechanicals. thats a whole other can o worms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassboy3313 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 1 hour ago, straight6pwr said: thats a whole other can o worms. I live dangerously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_cars Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 In almost every scenario, newer BMWs don't require additional tools to what you would use on any other older German car. If you have a bunch of extensions, basic metric sockets, ratcheting wrenches, u-joints, e-torx up to E18 and torx up to T60, then the only thing that limits you in regards to a newer model BMW is going to be the electronics in terms of coding. The coding issue is the biggest hurdle of working on any modern BMW exclusively by yourself (i.e. not having to take it to the dealer for coding when you are done), bar none. Luckily in the N-series space which is when coding REALLY started to become more prevalent for BMW, we now have cracks available for it. People I think get daunted by the sheer amount of "stuff" that's in the way of the motor, though. If you are a DIYer, then It absolutely takes longer to work on a newer BMW if you have to do invasive repairs/modifications. But if I'm someone like Snap who already sits on cars for years at a time without them driving, then why the hell would I care? It really boils down to taking your time and not being retarded about things. A few special cases for me - one example is I would not tear down an S65. The clearances are super tight on the internals and you really need to be familiar with it to guarantee you aren't gonna screw it up. Other than the few outliers, I don't really have a limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m42b32 Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 Never owned anything newer than my M3, and it's my first OBD2 car at that. I really enjoy the simplicity of the older cars. I will probably never have something newer than an e36 as a project car, but they are starting to get too old to be a viable DD. Yes, if you are super aggressive about keeping up with maintenance they can be great, that's what I have done with all of my cars, but there is always something needing attention as things just naturally wear out and 20+ winters start to take their toll.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 i think it has less to do with being afraid to tear shit apart and more so with i dont want to fuck with it. there is something to be said about (relatively) cheap simplicity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suspenceful Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 On 2/10/2016 at 10:13 AM, Snap said: DrLeadfoot's E46 not starting is a good example. Without an extremely detailed service manual, I wouldn't suspect the hood being popped to be a possible cause for a no-start condition. I remember the first time this happened with my E82. It was hilarious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Welter Posted February 21, 2016 Report Share Posted February 21, 2016 Initially the newer bmw's are a pain to get over the technology hump. Take it from me, I came from the audio world initially and basic engine work on my own domestics or Japanese cars. It took a while to figure out how the N54 works, but I'd never be afraid again. I'd honestly prefer an older bmw like an e30 though for simplicity. The really trying part of these new cars is when something acts up intermittently and you have to diagnose. A good challenge for all and it will test your troubleshooting abilities... Although I'm a bad example since mine went from oem to full retard in about 2 months. Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk i_love_cars 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_cars Posted February 21, 2016 Report Share Posted February 21, 2016 2 hours ago, Chris Welter said: Although I'm a bad example since mine went from oem to full retard in about 2 months. lolol truer words never spoken I will say after jumping into this turbo swap, I stand by my original statement that understanding how a car is put together and how things work together combined with diligence/patience will allow you to get through most things. However, it is astonishing just how much crap you have to remove to get at anything on newer BMWs. I spent about 6 hours just to clear the area to get to the turbo, and I spent probably 1.5 hours of that time just simply observing and taking stock of everything I was looking at because it's rare that I get an upclose look at the n-series this way. It's fascinating, but I'm with you - preference still goes to like an E30 or something. I think back to the first car I ever worked on seriously when I was old enough to realize what I was doing (16), which was a 1956 Bel-Air with a 289 v8 that only ran on 7 out of 8 cylinders, and I could literally just stand inside the engine bay with my feet on the cement below. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Welter Posted February 21, 2016 Report Share Posted February 21, 2016 Although I'm a bad example since mine went from oem to full retard in about 2 months. lolol truer words never spoken I will say after jumping into this turbo swap, I stand by my original statement that understanding how a car is put together and how things work together combined with diligence/patience will allow you to get through most things. However, it is astonishing just how much crap you have to remove to get at anything on newer BMWs. I spent about 6 hours just to clear the area to get to the turbo, and I spent probably 1.5 hours of that time just simply observing and taking stock of everything I was looking at because it's rare that I get an upclose look at the n-series this way. It's fascinating, but I'm with you - preference still goes to like an E30 or something. I think back to the first car I ever worked on seriously when I was old enough to realize what I was doing (16), which was a 1956 Bel-Air with a 289 v8 that only ran on 7 out of 8 cylinders, and I could literally just stand inside the engine bay with my feet on the cement below. Lol I am happy someone agrees with me [emoji3]. Yes it is overwhelming at times and you question why you are doing it over and over again in the process, but the end result is so sweet. Installing it is the first challenge, tuning it is the second. I came to a point that I was going to sell my car, then it was a 2jz swap with driveline changes, but after realizing it'd cost more for the same power and a more crappy powerband I decided to stay put in N54 land. Remember if you think about giving up just remember "at least it isn't an xdrive".. lol [emoji23] Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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