gilber33 Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 18 hours ago, SteelBlue said: I know most people would opt for a different motor than the M20, but I’ve really been enjoying it. Really great for the casual cruising and still comes alive above 5k. I also have the weird dichotomy of loving fast cars, but don't really have the need for speed much. That's exactly why I decided to spend money on refreshing the M20 rather than doing a swap. IMO, the amount of power is perfect. You can give it the beans and have a ton of fun on the backroads while not overly exceeding the speed limit. When I had my "stage 2" S60R it was too easy to go too fast. And at the end of the day, what was the point of it? In that second it was a lot of fun, but what I could have done to myself (with 3 kids) or someone else wasn't worth it. I sold it shortly after having that revelation. Rebuilding my m20 gave me a lot of respect for the engine and its place in the car. P_Roloff and SteelBlue 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 minute ago, gilber33 said: That's exactly why I decided to spend money on refreshing the M20 rather than doing a swap. IMO, the amount of power is perfect. You can give it the beans and have a ton of fun on the backroads while not overly exceeding the speed limit. When I had my "stage 2" S60R it was too easy to go too fast. And at the end of the day, what was the point of it? In that second it was a lot of fun, but what I could have done to myself (with 3 kids) or someone else wasn't worth it. I sold it shortly after having that revelation. Rebuilding my m20 gave me a lot of respect for the engine and its place in the car. I'm going to be doing a lot of reviewing your thread down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 18 minutes ago, SteelBlue said: What is needed for a 3.1? I've really only seen 2.7 and 2.9 examples. https://www.iemotorsport.com/product/ie-3-1l-stroker-kit-m20/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, B C said: https://www.iemotorsport.com/product/ie-3-1l-stroker-kit-m20/ Yellow text on a white background is horrid. That being said, this is very interesting. I see they suggest a WAR chip or running MS in addition to bigger injectors. If the WAR chip is an acceptable ECU tune, that would be prefer over going complete stand alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 WAR chip is acceptable on an OBD1 E36, but junk on an E30. The MAF conversion is very problematic. MS2 plug and play is just fine. Get it setup correctly and a dyno tune and you shouldnt have to touch it anymore and have a much better diagnostic and logging ability. The drivability and throttle response improvement are worth it alone on a stock M20 KaiserRolls 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekpoint Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 3 hours ago, B C said: WAR chip is acceptable on an OBD1 E36, but junk on an E30. The MAF conversion is very problematic. MS2 plug and play is just fine. Get it setup correctly and a dyno tune and you shouldnt have to touch it anymore and have a much better diagnostic and logging ability. The drivability and throttle response improvement are worth it alone on a stock M20 The war chip is junk in general. Don't bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 My vote is MS2 pnp. Not sure if they made an MS3 pnp for the m20? Rekpoint 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 MFW reading this thread and making a plan in my head. pls stop influencing me guys. I think if I were to do this, I would buy a separate M20 and do it on the side. S52 was a good learning experience, M20 seems to be a little more straight forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 Here is how it will play out: you grab a bimmerheads ported and polished rebuilt head with a cam, attach some ceramic coated headers while you are at it, Drop that in sometime in June. then work on a stroker bottom end build and preparing for MS2 over the winter. i kno, rite? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 Orrrrrrrr, k24 swap it & add cams. Better weight balance, more power, wasn’t brought to the US on the mayflower, etc. reading this for 245hp makes my wallet cry /roastme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 19 minutes ago, KaiserRolls said: reading this for 245hp makes my wallet cry /roastme 245hp at the crank after playing with the smoothing and correction factors, deleting the lot of 237bhp plots that preceeded it and dry-icing the intake. KaiserRolls, P_Roloff and m42b32 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m42b32 Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 32 minutes ago, KaiserRolls said: Orrrrrrrr, k24 swap it & add cams. Better weight balance, more power, wasn’t brought to the US on the mayflower, etc. reading this for 245hp makes my wallet cry /roastme I honestly wonder what the cost difference would really be between building the M20 already in your car vs swapping a K24. The adapter plate is like $1500 alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HipMF Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 Oil pump location on the K motor is right in the middle of the subframe on an e21/e30. Not that it can't be done, but it's not pretty and there is some fabrication involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 I'd rather stay with the M20 platform at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 hour ago, HipMF said: Oil pump location on the K motor is right in the middle of the subframe on an e21/e30. Not that it can't be done, but it's not pretty and there is some fabrication involved. Luckily kmiata exists and takes the headache out of the swap. The e30 k swap is much simpler than the Miata k swap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaiserRolls Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 hour ago, SteelBlue said: I'd rather stay with the M20 platform at this point. My original point was with the time/cost you’ll sink into a high strung 3.1L m20 would probably be close to putting a k in. Not to say the K is a cheap swap, but neither is building a motor. that being said my vote would still be do whatever you want because a high strung stroker m20 sounds sweet SteelBlue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekpoint Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 I vote m20 stroker because it is OEM + and I am all for OEM + SteelBlue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2020 3 hours ago, KaiserRolls said: My original point was with the time/cost you’ll sink into a high strung 3.1L m20 would probably be close to putting a k in. Not to say the K is a cheap swap, but neither is building a motor. that being said my vote would still be do whatever you want because a high strung stroker m20 sounds sweet Completely understand, it would definitely be a pricey build. I very much like the idea of retaining the M20, while being a modified variant, would adhere to the vast majority of maintenance, repairs, and trouble shooting sequences for a normal M20 3 hours ago, Rekpoint said: I vote m20 stroker because it is OEM + and I am all for OEM + I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patsbimmer1 Posted May 9, 2020 Report Share Posted May 9, 2020 11 hours ago, m42b32 said: With a car as clean and low mileage as yours I'd definitely be inclined to keep the original engine. There is absolutely no shame in liking an M20, they're pretty hard to hate! I'd love one to play around with again at some point. I totally agree that M20's (and the M30) are some of the best sounding BMW engines too, anything newer has absolutely nothing on them. The M30 is one of my favorite engines and I would absolutely buy a 535i just because of that but I also take exception to that last sentence... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunMetalGrey Posted May 9, 2020 Report Share Posted May 9, 2020 3 hours ago, patsbimmer1 said: The M30 is one of my favorite engines and I would absolutely buy a 535i just because of that but I also take exception to that last sentence... I'm glad to see the boat anchor is still going strong in this group! I think doing any engine swap on this car is dumb. It is a low mileage, low owner vehicle. While I do believe you should enjoy the vehicles you buy, I think if you wanted to build something swapped I would sell this one and build it off the profits. P_Roloff 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekpoint Posted May 9, 2020 Report Share Posted May 9, 2020 Just now, GunMetalGrey said: I'm glad to see the boat anchor is still going strong in this group! I think doing any engine swap on this car is dumb. It is a low mileage, low owner vehicle. While I do believe you should enjoy the vehicles you buy, I think if you wanted to build something swapped I would sell this one and build it off the profits. Technically he does have another shell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunMetalGrey Posted May 9, 2020 Report Share Posted May 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Rekpoint said: Technically he does have another shell Correct Though that thing has been bouncing around like a bad case of VD. Not that I helped the situation any! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBlue Posted May 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 Here's my YouTube click baity post of the week. Going to be picking up something for the car in Madison this weekend that I kind of fell backwards into. Something I've wanted for a long time, and, even appears to be the same color as my car. Also a great deal that I couldn't pass up. Insert capitalized words and exclamation points where you see fit. P_Roloff 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HipMF Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 SteelBlue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B C Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 Please let it be this Cadillac Service Manual!!!!! jc43089, m42b32 and SteelBlue 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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